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TOPIC: Landyard tests

Landyard tests 5 years 10 months ago #3552

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http://www.caves.org/section/vertica...d_tests_v6.pdf

Interesting .Pdf on Cows-tails drop tests, worrying to note that Spelegyca came out worst, and I own a pair :dry:
Last Edit: 5 years 10 months ago by Suboffender.
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Re: Landyard tests 5 years 10 months ago #3553

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I can't get this link to work :-(
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Re: Landyard tests 5 years 10 months ago #3555

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best making your ouw out of climbing rope
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Re: Landyard tests 5 years 10 months ago #3558

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Re: Landyard tests 5 years 10 months ago #3559

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If i read this right, Basically its saying that in the event of falling onto your cows tails, those that are tied with knots reduce the force the most (The knots tighten and help absorb the shock), the ones that are stitched are a bit more vicious and the ones made of Spelegyca tape are totally non dynamic and therefore are the 'worst'. Nothing new there. Thats the eact same reason that great care must be given to using slings in climbing to clip into belays etc. The non dynamic nature means that the forces applied to a) the human and b) the anchor (which could cause failure) are huge.

Cows tails should ideally be dynamic to absorb the energy in the event of a fall but in addition to that, the most important thing it to ensure that cowstails are used properly such as to minimise any fall factor. That it why its important that cowstails are kept as short as possible and also to ensure that the correct, long/short tail is clipped to the right place.

The common sense approach being that you should never have any (or at least keep it to a minimum) 'slack' when a cowstail is clipped to something.

Strictly speaking - if you are doing everything by the book you should never ever be in a position where you could take a factor fall onto a cowstail but we all know that in practicable terms this is never likely to be the case.

That being the case the more dynamic the cowstails the better - therefore Mikes comment about using dynamic climbing rope, knotted rather than stitched is bang on the money.
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Re: Landyard tests 5 years 9 months ago #3649

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just to put you a pearce to put a fall factor of 1 on your cows tails you would have to climb the full length of your cows tail up from your hanging point you would be unlikely to do as you would not be able to reach down to reach your grab, the majority
of cavers would do 0.50 of a fall factor of 1 and thats pushing it.
i remember my early years of caving when tieing into a rebelay to tie in a lose figue
8 on the curve side of the rope and should the anchor give the knot would tighten up and asorb most of the shock load not seen much these days due to double anchors
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Re: Landyard tests 5 years 9 months ago #3656

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Tim - nice one :) also, your knots should be double barrel knots and not fig 8 knots as barrels absorb more than fig 8's; they also tightn up onto the krab so as when at pitch head or traverse line, it is easier and safer to clip into traverse line or 'Y' hang. Basically, you're not hanging there mumbling 'where the fcuk is my krab!' or 'why the hell is my krab upside down!':whistle:
Love it . . . :)
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Re: Landyard tests 5 years 9 months ago #3659

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lab rat wrote:
Tim - nice one :) also, your knots should be double barrel knots and not fig 8 knots as barrels absorb more than fig 8's; they also tightn up onto the krab so as when at pitch head or traverse line, it is easier and safer to clip into traverse line or 'Y' hang. Basically, you're not hanging there mumbling 'where the fcuk is my krab!' or 'why the hell is my krab upside down!':whistle:

hear hear look on utube about how to make cowstails.i would give you a link like the rest of you techno guy's but im essentially a tecno fobe
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Re: Landyard tests 5 years 9 months ago #3663

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Mike, you mean this one...?

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Re: Landyard tests 5 years 9 months ago #3665

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TimWatts wrote:
Mike, you mean this one...?


hey dude thats the one . your such a lovely guy :oops: :oops: :oops: :blush: :blush:
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Re: Landyard tests 5 years 9 months ago #3666

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Shh - we need to keep that side of things quiet and just between you and me!
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Re: Landyard tests 5 years 9 months ago #3667

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Not sure I agree with his opinion on the correct krabs. Nobody ever screws them up each time, its such a faff when you are traversing or passing rebelays.

And why does he tie a threadded fig 8 on his main maillion? He could have easily just tied it first then slipped it onto the mallion after.

My 2p worth... :silly:

and what is going on between you and Leahy then Tim? I thought you only had eyes for me...
I'm a very busy person
Last Edit: 5 years 9 months ago by LesW.
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Re: Landyard tests 5 years 9 months ago #3668

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Haha - what went on in that tent at hidden earth is between you and me!

Yes, i wondered about the rethreaded fig8 myself.

Also i use non locking WIREgates. The wire gates never crud up and stick with particles of grit etc like normal gated biners can/do.
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Re: Landyard tests 5 years 9 months ago #3762

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Only just got back to this thread. Thanks for re-posting my broken link Tim.

I also use non screw gate krabs. I find it's good practice to clip on with the gate facing towards you and away from the rock. this helps avoid the gate opening accidentally when pushed against the rock.

I think it's down to personal preference when it comes to which krabs to use on cowstails.
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Re: Landyard tests 5 years 9 months ago #3791

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He uses a rethread coz his oval gate is way too tight to undo :lol: :lol:

On my cows tails I use a screw gate on the short and a snap link gate on the long. My reasons are:

i) My short is very short - the rope is 15cm between both knots; when I come into land at a rebelay, I can clip striaght into the metal work and do up the sr=crew gate and hang knowing that nothing is going undo it or force it open. My shorty is short so as I dont have far to go on landing and running my descender through till slackness arrives :) Btw, my long is clipped ino the loop by its snap ling gate. its length of rope from knot to knot is 37cm.

ii) when I trained, Andy Sparrow said use snap links and have your short cows tail short; John Crowsley said use screw gates and have your short cows tail short - so..... I use both and I find it works well.

Barrel knots and NOT fig 8s onto the krabs. And yep, try and clip away from the rock otherwise you might just find your krab off the traverse line .... eeeeeek

:)
Love it . . . :)
Last Edit: 5 years 9 months ago by Labrat.
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Re: Landyard tests 5 years 9 months ago #3794

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Yes. I don't think anyone says anything other than barrel knots onto krabs. Fig of 8 only for the middle knot.

Although i have a very old set that i 'obtained' that was already tied with fig8's for all three knots which i never changed coz they were bloody tight and so I wrapped a piece of tape round to hold each krab in the right place - i never died. :woohoo:
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Re: Landyard tests 5 years 9 months ago #3795

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And my current 'best' set is a commercial set which is stitched and 'not very' dynamic. And is going to be painful as and when i take any kind of factor fall on it. But then again, i think my ample layer of body fat will absorb more energy than 15cm on rope (dynamic of not).
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